What's New For Phoenix?

[x635 31]

HasPhoenix FD has anything new or exciting delivered or ordered lately?

[GilbertFIRE 34]

i

HasPhoenix FD has anything new or exciting delivered or ordered lately?

 

Last I heard 

Soon, 4 to 7 engines (one for E9)   1 to 2 Ladders towers ,(1 for L24 or will get a midmount handed down)  2 or 3 LT's , 1 U, 1 HM

I believe the LT's are already ordered  

[pump305 32]

Is Phoenix using Tower Ladder only? Are the remaining tillers in reserve? Thanks.

[GilbertFIRE 34]

All Ladder Co's have midmount Ladder Towers except L1 & L22 have Rear mount Ladder Towers and L9 has a  Bronto Skylift

 

Reserve Fleet  has 4 Tiller Ladders, 1 Mid Mount Ladder Tower  & 1 rear Mount Ladder Tower  

[pump305 32]

GilbertFire... Thank you! Do you have any idea why thet stoped using tillers?

[GilbertFIRE 34]

You can do more with a bucket

[vegasbuff 9]

A lot more with the bucket on the tower ladders. I have read of some fine rescues using the bucket

all over the U. S.

[Phxmtn34 0]

L24 new rig is old L1 swapped them out

[Phxmtn34 0]

LT1 LT4 LT9 LT26 are still in their old origina LT's

[GilbertFIRE 34]

They should be replaced very soon 

[firepost 15]

A lot more with the bucket on the tower ladders. I have read of some fine rescues using the bucket

all over the U. S.

Yes I agree with this assessment of Tower Ladders or Aerial Platforms in general. I still wonder why they haven't tried more of them out in the Los Angeles area.

Perhaps when Los Angeles finally gets a new fire chief he would be willing to try out some Tower Ladders for the LA city fire department. I know that Long Beach has had one for quite a while now. 

So far this is only wishful thinking however.

[hp1530 2]

Yes I agree with this assessment of Tower Ladders or Aerial Platforms in general. I still wonder why they haven't tried more of them out in the Los Angeles area.

Perhaps when Los Angeles finally gets a new fire chief he would be willing to try out some Tower Ladders for the LA city fire department. I know that Long Beach has had one for quite a while now. 

So far this is only wishful thinking however.

 

Phoenix is a much more open city than the streets of LA and thus they have more space to maneuver. I've been to Phoenix and the city is definitely more wide and open terrain than the streets of LA.

 

If you think a tower ladder or any straight truck will fit through some of the streets in former Battalion 7 area, then I'm all for it. Some of those streets are narrow that a regular engine has clearance of just a few inches on both sides. While you may argue that FDNY encounters similar issues, they have used since the 60's so it's been a part of their operations.

 

I really can't speak for LA City but LA County has gone through a chief and so far no ladder towers or platforms have resurfaced. The dept did get a few back in the late 80's/90's and I believe they may have 1 left in reserve. If you have noticed, dver the years, all the straight ladders/quints/tillers have been slowly replaced by tiller quints.

 

LA City has gone over 43 years since the Crown Snorkels and they have not gotten another one aside from those 2 85' Snorkels. LAFD did try to buy a Seagrave Eagle platform back in 1964 but that was rejected. Unless the next fire chief is the FD equivalent of former LAPD Chief Bratton, but I'd doubt the next chief would rock the boat. 

 

 

/Rant

[GilbertFIRE 34]

Phoenix F1 got a brand new  4500 Striker , Anyone know what the old Striker is going to be  F-?  reserve/spare unit ? 

this with be their  5th Striker    

[firepost 15]

Phoenix is a much more open city than the streets of LA and thus they have more space to maneuver. I've been to Phoenix and the city is definitely more wide and open terrain than the streets of LA.

 

If you think a tower ladder or any straight truck will fit through some of the streets in former Battalion 7 area, then I'm all for it. Some of those streets are narrow that a regular engine has clearance of just a few inches on both sides. While you may argue that FDNY encounters similar issues, they have used since the 60's so it's been a part of their operations.

 

I really can't speak for LA City but LA County has gone through a chief and so far no ladder towers or platforms have resurfaced. The dept did get a few back in the late 80's/90's and I believe they may have 1 left in reserve. If you have noticed, dver the years, all the straight ladders/quints/tillers have been slowly replaced by tiller quints.

 

LA City has gone over 43 years since the Crown Snorkels and they have not gotten another one aside from those 2 85' Snorkels. LAFD did try to buy a Seagrave Eagle platform back in 1964 but that was rejected. Unless the next fire chief is the FD equivalent of former LAPD Chief Bratton, but I'd doubt the next chief would rock the boat. 

 

 

/Rant

Yes hp1530 I too remember when Snorkel 3 on the LAFD city fire department had flipped over in 1970. The findings were that the rig's outriggers weren't fully extended. That incident had made the LAFD (tall aerial) platform shy as after the accident both of their 85 foot Snorkels (3 and 27) were taken out of service. The LA city fire department did have 4 50 foot Snorkels that were built on Engine chassis and they had remained in service as part of four out of five former "Heavy Duty' Task Forces though 1978 when they were taken out of service. A few of the 50 foot Snorkel/Pumpers had been assigned to some other  companies until the mid 1980's when they were finally retired..

 

 It was a tragedy that the accident in 1970 was fatal and a fire fighter Thomas C Collier  was killed however in April of 1979 another firefighter Brian E Phillips was killed when a ladder pipe had come loose and knocked him off of the Ladder when fighting a fire at 7151 Lankershim in the "Valley". The point that I'm trying to make is that both of those accidents were tragic but just as ladder pipes weren't banned after the Ladder Pipe came loose in 1979 for the same reason tall Aerial Platforms shouldn't be banned either. Accidents sometimes happen but it doesn't mean that a piece of equipment should be banned..

[joeyk48 25]

Yes hp1530 I too remember when Snorkel 3 on the LAFD city fire department had flipped over in 1970. The findings were that the rig's outriggers weren't fully extended. That incident had made the LAFD (tall aerial) platform shy as after the accident both of their 85 foot Snorkels (3 and 27) were taken out of service. The LA city fire department did have 4 50 foot Snorkels that were built on Engine chassis and they had remained in service as part of four out of five former "Heavy Duty' Task Forces though 1978 when they were taken out of service. A few of the 50 foot Snorkel/Pumpers had been assigned to some other  companies until the mid 1980's when they were finally retired..

 

 It was a tragedy that the accident in 1970 was fatal and a fire fighter Thomas C Collier  was killed however in April of 1979 another firefighter Brian E Phillips was killed when a ladder pipe had come loose and knocked him off of the Ladder when fighting a fire at 7151 Lankershim in the "Valley". The point that I'm trying to make is that both of those accidents were tragic but just as ladder pipes weren't banned after the Ladder Pipe came loose in 1979 for the same reason tall Aerial Platforms shouldn't be banned either. Accidents sometimes happen but it doesn't mean that a piece of equipment should be banned..

aerial  platforms are not banned in la city,they just choose not to use them. as hp said they are too big for the small streets and alleys of los angeles. the turning radius on a tiller is much better than any platform out there, who wants to make a 10 point turn to get into an alley when a tiller can do it in one. then there is weight issues with the duel rear axle, on a tiller it is much more spread out . then you have a huge overhang either in the front or the rear which has a big kick out. if you look around so-cal as well as most of ca, fire depts. are returning to tillers as opposed to straight frame ladders or platforms because they work well. why would la city fool with one of the concepts that has worked well for them for over 30 years

[hp1530 2]

aerial  platforms are not banned in la city,they just choose not to use them. as hp said they are too big for the small streets and alleys of los angeles. the turning radius on a tiller is much better than any platform out there, who wants to make a 10 point turn to get into an alley when a tiller can do it in one. then there is weight issues with the duel rear axle, on a tiller it is much more spread out . then you have a huge overhang either in the front or the rear which has a big kick out. if you look around so-cal as well as most of ca, fire depts. are returning to tillers as opposed to straight frame ladders or platforms because they work well. why would la city fool with one of the concepts that has worked well for them for over 30 years

 

To add onto what Joey has said.

 

More like why would LAFD change something that has worked well for them for over 100 years. In looking at the historical pics from a century ago, the LAFD has continuously bought tiller ladders or city service ladder trucks that had 2 steering wheels. All their trucks have bent in the middle and had 2 steering wheels.

 

I have seen pics of LAFD testing a LA County Tiller quint. Guess they did not like it as they never got one. Again, chances are, a quint doesn't fit into the department's needs and thus they never got one. That does not preclude LAFD from getting one maybe in the future, but so far all have been just tillers.

[hp1530 2]

Yes hp1530 I too remember when Snorkel 3 on the LAFD city fire department had flipped over in 1970. The findings were that the rig's outriggers weren't fully extended. That incident had made the LAFD (tall aerial) platform shy as after the accident both of their 85 foot Snorkels (3 and 27) were taken out of service. The LA city fire department did have 4 50 foot Snorkels that were built on Engine chassis and they had remained in service as part of four out of five former "Heavy Duty' Task Forces though 1978 when they were taken out of service. A few of the 50 foot Snorkel/Pumpers had been assigned to some other  companies until the mid 1980's when they were finally retired..

 

 It was a tragedy that the accident in 1970 was fatal and a fire fighter Thomas C Collier  was killed however in April of 1979 another firefighter Brian E Phillips was killed when a ladder pipe had come loose and knocked him off of the Ladder when fighting a fire at 7151 Lankershim in the "Valley". The point that I'm trying to make is that both of those accidents were tragic but just as ladder pipes weren't banned after the Ladder Pipe came loose in 1979 for the same reason tall Aerial Platforms shouldn't be banned either. Accidents sometimes happen but it doesn't mean that a piece of equipment should be banned..

 

If you notice, most of the Snorkels, Tele-Squirts and Squirts were purchased in the late 60s, early 70's. Chief Hill was also the chief who developed the task force concept as well. Note that there were no more Snorkel products purchased after Chief Hill left office in 1975.

 

While that is true, that accidents do happen there were pictures of Snorkel 3 post accident that indicates it could have been saved. I really don't know what the whole story is, but LAFD blamed Snorkel and Snorkel found the department to be at fault for the tip over. Ultimately Snorkel redesigned the Snorkel with a interlock on the jacks. LAFD has not bought another aerial platform since then. 

 

I don't care for the backstory, but point is, if LAFD really wanted another Snorkel, Aerialscope or tower, they could have got one. 38 years and 6 Chiefs later, no platforms, tower ladders of any sort have been purchased. You also don't give the firefighters credit. They do have some input on apparatus specs as well. In 38 years, many FF have come and gone and they don't seem to be jumping up and down for an aerial platform as well.

[joeyk48 25]

tillers are the way to go in los angeles , no question about that, in most big cities you will see tillers, granted there are a few towers and platforms here and there but  tillers are proven to be effective  and useful in most places. I have family on the job in philly and they have a couple snorkels and platforms, but ask any of the guys and they will take a tiller hands down over a platform or tower

[Casey 14]

Firepost,

Unless I'm not reading it correctly, FF Taylor fell through the roof, and not off the ladder due to a ladder pipe malfunction. The site is run by a LAFD member and not a buff. If you are so "concerned" about the lack of Snorkles, Towers etc, write the new chief when they are appointed and get the official answer to your concerns.

http://lafire.com/lastalarm_file/last_alarm-index.htm

As a side note, the arsonist was up for parole earlier this year, and again was denied

Respectfully submitted,

[firepost 15]

Firepost,

Unless I'm not reading it correctly, FF Taylor fell through the roof, and not off the ladder due to a ladder pipe malfunction. The site is run by a LAFD member and not a buff. If you are so "concerned" about the lack of Snorkles, Towers etc, write the new chief when they are appointed and get the official answer to your concerns.

http://lafire.com/lastalarm_file/last_alarm-index.htm

As a side note, the arsonist was up for parole earlier this year, and again was denied

Respectfully submitted,

 Casey you were looking at the wrong fire. I wasn't talking about firefighter Taylor who  fell though the roof at a restaurant fire(on January 28 1981). I was talking about firefighter Phillips who was knocked off of an Aerial Ladder at a Lumber Yard fire (on April 25th 1979)  about 2 years earlier. Both of the fires were located on Lankershim however they were over two miles apart in distance.

[Monrovia1 21]

 Casey you were looking at the wrong fire. I wasn't talking about firefighter Taylor who  fell though the roof at a restaurant fire(on January 28 1981). I was talking about firefighter Phillips who was knocked off of an Aerial Ladder at a Lumber Yard fire (on April 25th 1979)  about 2 years earlier. Both of the fires were located on Lankershim however they were over two miles apart in distance.

Firefighter Taylor was on that fire. If you look on lafire.com you can see him in one of the photos.

[Casey 14]

Casey you were looking at the wrong fire. I wasn't talking about firefighter Taylor who fell though the roof at a restaurant fire(on January 28 1981). I was talking about firefighter Phillips who was knocked off of an Aerial Ladder at a Lumber Yard fire (on April 25th 1979) about 2 years earlier. Both of the fires were located on Lankershim however they were over two miles apart in distance.

My apologies, but my suggestion still stands as to your writing the next permanent Chief as to your concerns about the lack of Towers/Platforms etc.

[Monrovia1 21]

My apologies, but my suggestion still stands as to your writing the next permanent Chief as to your concerns about the lack of Towers/Platforms etc.

 

 

The 110 freeway is a good example why tower ladders wouldn't work, Some of the entrances and exits are very very narrow and a rear mount aerial wouldn't have enough clearance to get under some of the underpasses.